Any ideas why LibreOffice Help requires Epiphany browser?

[Yrrah]

Linux Mint 19.2 Cinnamon; LibreOffice 6.3.0.4.
Installing libreoffice-help-en-us, libreoffice-help-en-gb or help in
any foreign language now requires installing epiphany-browser and
epiphany-browser-data. Uninstalling that piece of sh*t is virtually
impossible as Synaptic then wants to install a long list of other
software. Never noticed this before. Nothing about this in the Release
Notes. What the f*ck is going on there?
It must be a new "feature" and is a deal breaker afaiac.

Yrrah

[Mike Easter]

Post by Yrrah
Linux Mint 19.2 Cinnamon; LibreOffice 6.3.0.4.
Installing libreoffice-help-en-us, libreoffice-help-en-gb or help in
any foreign language now requires installing epiphany-browser and
epiphany-browser-data. Uninstalling that piece of sh*t is virtually
impossible as Synaptic then wants to install a long list of other
software. Never noticed this before. Nothing about this in the Release
Notes. What the f*ck is going on there?
It must be a new "feature" and is a deal breaker afaiac.

I'm not seeing that.

If I add the LO .ppa to a 19.2 live Cinn so as to get 6.3.0 in the
repos, the help doesn't require Epiphany.

[Yrrah]

Post by Mike Easter

Post by Yrrah
Linux Mint 19.2 Cinnamon; LibreOffice 6.3.0.4.
Installing libreoffice-help-en-us, libreoffice-help-en-gb or help in
any foreign language now requires installing epiphany-browser and
epiphany-browser-data. Uninstalling that piece of sh*t is virtually
impossible as Synaptic then wants to install a long list of other
software. Never noticed this before. Nothing about this in the Release
Notes. What the f*ck is going on there?
It must be a new "feature" and is a deal breaker afaiac.

I'm not seeing that.
If I add the LO .ppa to a 19.2 live Cinn so as to get 6.3.0 in the
repos, the help doesn't require Epiphany.

I didn't see it yesterday either when I updated LO to 6.3.0. The
problem started today with a new help update.
I used this PPA:
https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ubuntu/ppa

Anyway, I uninstalled v. 6.3.0.4 and reinstalled v. 6.2.5.2 from this
PPA:
https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ubuntu/libreoffice-6-2
Problem gone.

Yrrah

[Mike Easter]

Post by Mike Easter

Post by Yrrah
Linux Mint 19.2 Cinnamon; LibreOffice 6.3.0.4.
Installing libreoffice-help-en-us, libreoffice-help-en-gb or help in
any foreign language now requires installing epiphany-browser and
epiphany-browser-data. Uninstalling that piece of sh*t is virtually
impossible as Synaptic then wants to install a long list of other
software. Never noticed this before. Nothing about this in the Release
Notes. What the f*ck is going on there?
It must be a new "feature" and is a deal breaker afaiac.

I'm not seeing that.
If I add the LO .ppa to a 19.2 live Cinn so as to get 6.3.0 in the
repos, the help doesn't require Epiphany.

After I update and open LO, the Help says the v. is 6.3.0.4 and help
(en-us) opens in the default Ffx browser.

Also, Help section on LO Help says that Help opens in the default browser.

There is also a section on LO Help in the release notes.

Re Epiphany: it looks like the epiphany browser is now called Gnome Web
and it is allegedly lightweight. There is a MUO article on 'why one
should use GW' which idea seems to be largely based on its function for
web apps.

https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/epiphany-web-apps-integrate-web-desktop/
5 Reasons to Start Using GNOME Epiphany Web App

Maybe if there were a LO help which aimed itself at some kind of webapp
for Help, then epiphany/GW would be the tool to see it. For me, LO Help
in Ffx is web pages from local files in usr/share.

[greybeard]

Post by Mike Easter

Post by Mike Easter

Post by Yrrah
Linux Mint 19.2 Cinnamon; LibreOffice 6.3.0.4.
Installing libreoffice-help-en-us, libreoffice-help-en-gb or help in
any foreign language now requires installing epiphany-browser and
epiphany-browser-data. Uninstalling that piece of sh*t is virtually
impossible as Synaptic then wants to install a long list of other
software. Never noticed this before. Nothing about this in the Release
Notes. What the f*ck is going on there?
It must be a new "feature" and is a deal breaker afaiac.

I'm not seeing that.
If I add the LO .ppa to a 19.2 live Cinn so as to get 6.3.0 in the
repos, the help doesn't require Epiphany.

After I update and open LO, the Help says the v. is 6.3.0.4 and help
(en-us) opens in the default Ffx browser.
Also, Help section on LO Help says that Help opens in the default browser.
There is also a section on LO Help in the release notes.
Re Epiphany:  it looks like the epiphany browser is now called Gnome Web
and it is allegedly lightweight.  There is a MUO article on 'why one
should use GW' which idea seems to be largely based on its function for
web apps.
https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/epiphany-web-apps-integrate-web-desktop/ 5
Reasons to Start Using GNOME Epiphany Web App
Maybe if there were a LO help which aimed itself at some kind of webapp
for Help, then epiphany/GW would be the tool to see it.  For me, LO Help
in Ffx is web pages from local files in usr/share.

Does the latest version restore the "Insert-Row" in spreadsheets that is
missing from the last two versions??

[Mike Easter]

Post by greybeard
Does the latest version restore the "Insert-Row" in spreadsheets that is
missing from the last two versions??

I don't use spreadsheets but according to Help and what I see in LO
Calc, I see Menu Sheet/ (Top Insert section) Rows (above/below), Columns
(before/after) and Cells (4 choices shift cells down, right, and entire
row or column).

Is that what you mean?

[greybeard]

Post by Mike Easter

Post by greybeard
Does the latest version restore the "Insert-Row" in spreadsheets that is
missing from the last two versions??

I don't use spreadsheets but according to Help and what I see in LO
Calc, I see Menu Sheet/ (Top Insert section) Rows (above/below), Columns
(before/after) and Cells (4 choices shift cells down, right, and entire
row or column).
Is that what you mean?

Yes. Version 5.1.6.2 libre office calc (spreadsheet)

There is no Insert Row~Col on top menu drop down. Disappeared on update
prior to 5.1.6.2 whatever it was. Since I use calc frequently, not happy!
How do I erase and re-install please? Basic instruction for novice?

[Mike Easter]

Post by greybeard
How do I erase and re-install please? Basic instruction for novice?

I like to do things w/ the synaptic package manager whenever possible.
I'm looking at a live Mint 19.2 Cinn. If my v. of LO were 5.1, I think
I would uninstall it w/ the Remove function in Synaptic because the v.
is so much older.

Hmm. I just looked at that. Since there are so many LO parts, I think
it would be easier to remove them w/ the Software manager and to install
the newer v. w/ synaptic after you get the .ppa.

Software manager: uninstall the parts: Writer, Calc, Impress, Draw,
Math, and the Help/s.

Then I would install the 6.3 .ppa which is provided by the LO packaging
team. I would do that by C&P copy/paste the commands found on this
page: https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ubuntu/ppa Adding
this PPA to your system

sudo add-apt-repository ppa:libreoffice/ppa
sudo apt-get update

There are also non-command line ways to add .ppa, but for some tasks
like this, I think the pasted command is easiest and communicate.

Or, you can do the update w/ synaptic, going back to synaptic which I
normally prefer over the software manager.

After the update, then you can use synaptic to install LO, which will
now be newer than the one in the default Ub repos, 6.0.7 before adding
the 6.3 LO .ppa. In this specific case, if you prefer the software
manager, it should work just as well. I usually prefer synaptic because
it is more 'robust', but in this case I don't think you need robust.

[Mike Easter]

Oops error.

Post by Mike Easter
Then I would install the 6.3 .ppa which is provided by the LO packaging
team.  I would do that by C&P copy/paste the commands found on this
page:  https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ubuntu/ppa  Adding
this PPA to your system

Move past that front page to the specific for 6.3:
https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ubuntu/libreoffice-6-3
LibreOffice 6.3.x

Adding this PPA to your system

You can update your system with unsupported packages from this untrusted
PPA by adding ppa:libreoffice/libreoffice-6-3 to your system's Software
Sources. (Read about installing)

sudo add-apt-repository ppa:libreoffice/libreoffice-6-3
sudo apt-get update

... instead of what I pasted earlier from the front page.

[John B.]

Post by greybeard

Post by Mike Easter

Post by greybeard
Does the latest version restore the "Insert-Row" in spreadsheets that is
missing from the last two versions??

I don't use spreadsheets but according to Help and what I see in LO
Calc, I see Menu Sheet/ (Top Insert section) Rows (above/below), Columns
(before/after) and Cells (4 choices shift cells down, right, and entire
row or column).
Is that what you mean?

Yes. Version 5.1.6.2 libre office calc (spreadsheet)
There is no Insert Row~Col on top menu drop down. Disappeared on update
prior to 5.1.6.2 whatever it was. Since I use calc frequently, not happy!
How do I erase and re-install please? Basic instruction for novice?

I am currently using LibreOffice 5.1.6.2 and there is an "insert"
column/row. Simply right click on the column/ row and select "insert",
or "delete".
--
cheers,

John B.

[Edmund]

Post by John B.

Post by greybeard

Post by Mike Easter

Post by greybeard
Does the latest version restore the "Insert-Row" in spreadsheets that is
missing from the last two versions??

I don't use spreadsheets but according to Help and what I see in LO
Calc, I see Menu Sheet/ (Top Insert section) Rows (above/below), Columns
(before/after) and Cells (4 choices shift cells down, right, and entire
row or column).
Is that what you mean?

Yes. Version 5.1.6.2 libre office calc (spreadsheet)
There is no Insert Row~Col on top menu drop down. Disappeared on update
prior to 5.1.6.2 whatever it was. Since I use calc frequently, not happy!
How do I erase and re-install please? Basic instruction for novice?

I am currently using LibreOffice 5.1.6.2 and there is an "insert"
column/row. Simply right click on the column/ row and select "insert",
or "delete".
--
cheers,
John B.

I don't use it very much, I am mostly using spreadsheets I created a
long time ago.
BUT, IF an option disappears in a new release, wouldn't it be logic
to ask the developers what happened?
It sure helped me -and others- in one or two occasions.

My view on the zillion linux releases each with their own incompatible
repositories must be very clear here, I am absolutely flabbergasted by
the fact so many people run into problems just because of that but
still do NOT agree with me, instead they add ppa's. :-)

Edmund

[Aragorn]

Post by Edmund
I don't use it very much, I am mostly using spreadsheets I created a
long time ago. BUT, IF an option disappears in a new release,
wouldn't it be logic to ask the developers what happened?

You could file a bug report. It's what people do, and then the
developers might heed the complaint and change things back.

Of course, you'd have to file the bug report with the LibreOffice
developers directly, not with the Mint developers, because the Mint
developers can only package the software, and perhaps patch it or
customize it so it works together well with the rest of the
distribution.

Post by Edmund
My view on the zillion linux releases each with their own
incompatible repositories must be very clear here, I am absolutely
flabbergasted by the fact so many people run into problems just
because of that but still do NOT agree with me, instead they add
ppa's. :-)

It is YOU who do not understand. Every distribution has its own
repositories, and there is a good reason for that too. It means that
the software that's in the repositories for that particular
distribution has been tested to work on that distribution — as opposed
to software you download from somewhere else on the intergoogles.

Also very importantly, software from the repositories comes with a
checksum and a signature, so that your package manager can check the
package's integrity to see whether it has been compromised, and that it
can verify that the package bears the official signature of the
distribution.

When it comes to PPAs, the package can usually be trusted, although
there is no guarantee, given that PPAs are community-based repositories.

Lastly, if you do want to install software that didn't come with the
distribution and that you cannot find in a PPA, then there are
technologies like Snap and FlatPak, which allow you to install software
in a sandboxed environment, so that it doesn't corrupt the rest of the
system with incompatible libraries, and so that the software can be
bundled with its own libraries.

Snap and FlatPak are both designed to allow the installation of
software that is distribution-agnostic, and because of the sandboxed
environment, you can always safely remove said software again if you
don't like it.

The downside of such a sandboxed approach on the other hand is that the
software won't be perfectly integrated with the rest of the system in
terms of look & feel, exactly because it comes with its own
configuration and its own libraries, whereas the rest of the
distribution is dynamically linked and uses shared libraries.

[Edmund]

Post by Aragorn

Post by Edmund
I don't use it very much, I am mostly using spreadsheets I created a
long time ago. BUT, IF an option disappears in a new release,
wouldn't it be logic to ask the developers what happened?

You could file a bug report. It's what people do, and then the
developers might heed the complaint and change things back.

It could just be a different way of controlling things, it doesn't
have to be a bug.

Post by Aragorn
Of course, you'd have to file the bug report with the LibreOffice
developers directly, not with the Mint developers, because the Mint
developers can only package the software, and perhaps patch it or
customize it so it works together well with the rest of the
distribution.

Post by Edmund
My view on the zillion linux releases each with their own
incompatible repositories must be very clear here, I am absolutely
flabbergasted by the fact so many people run into problems just
because of that but still do NOT agree with me, instead they add
ppa's. :-)

It is YOU who do not understand. Every distribution has its own
repositories, and there is a good reason for that too. It means that
the software that's in the repositories for that particular
distribution has been tested to work on that distribution — as opposed
to software you download from somewhere else on the intergoogles.

Keep on convincing yourself, you are only missing a tiny little
thing here but I am NOT going to explain that every day for the rest
of my life.

I know -very well- it isn't going to change.

Edmund

[Aragorn]

Post by Edmund

Post by Aragorn

Post by Edmund
I don't use it very much, I am mostly using spreadsheets I created
a long time ago. BUT, IF an option disappears in a new release,
wouldn't it be logic to ask the developers what happened?

You could file a bug report. It's what people do, and then the
developers might heed the complaint and change things back.

It could just be a different way of controlling things, it doesn't
have to be a bug.

You're missing the point again. Feature requests are submitted by way
of bug reports. That's how the system works.

Post by Edmund

Post by Aragorn

Post by Edmund
My view on the zillion linux releases each with their own
incompatible repositories must be very clear here, I am absolutely
flabbergasted by the fact so many people run into problems just
because of that but still do NOT agree with me, instead they add
ppa's. :-)

It is YOU who do not understand. Every distribution has its own
repositories, and there is a good reason for that too. It means
that the software that's in the repositories for that particular
distribution has been tested to work on that distribution — as
opposed to software you download from somewhere else on the
intergoogles.

Keep on convincing yourself, you are only missing a tiny little
thing here but I am NOT going to explain that every day for the rest
of my life.

I don't have to convince myself. I run Manjaro Stable, and I only use
software from the Manjaro repositories, and two applications from the
AUR ("Arch User Repository"), which is supported by the Manjaro package
manager, although you have to build those packages from sources (in a
semi-automated way).

I don't have any need for anything else.

[Edmund]

Post by Aragorn

Post by Edmund

Post by Aragorn

Post by Edmund
I don't use it very much, I am mostly using spreadsheets I created
a long time ago. BUT, IF an option disappears in a new release,
wouldn't it be logic to ask the developers what happened?

You could file a bug report. It's what people do, and then the
developers might heed the complaint and change things back.

It could just be a different way of controlling things, it doesn't
have to be a bug.

You're missing the point again.

Actually, you do.

Post by Aragorn
Feature requests are submitted by way
of bug reports. That's how the system works.

Asking if things work differently is NOT a feature request.

Post by Aragorn

Post by Edmund

Post by Aragorn

Post by Edmund
My view on the zillion linux releases each with their own
incompatible repositories must be very clear here, I am absolutely
flabbergasted by the fact so many people run into problems just
because of that but still do NOT agree with me, instead they add
ppa's. :-)

It is YOU who do not understand. Every distribution has its own
repositories, and there is a good reason for that too. It means
that the software that's in the repositories for that particular
distribution has been tested to work on that distribution — as
opposed to software you download from somewhere else on the
intergoogles.

Keep on convincing yourself, you are only missing a tiny little
thing here but I am NOT going to explain that every day for the rest
of my life.

I don't have to convince myself. I run Manjaro Stable, and I only use
software from the Manjaro repositories, and two applications from the
AUR ("Arch User Repository"), which is supported by the Manjaro package
manager, although you have to build those packages from sources (in a
semi-automated way).

With this response you are completely missing the point.

Post by Aragorn
I don't have any need for anything else.

This is interesting by itself, many linux believers advocating
a perpetual growing number of releases DE and incompatible repositories.

[John B.]

Post by Edmund

Post by John B.

Post by greybeard

Post by Mike Easter

Post by greybeard
Does the latest version restore the "Insert-Row" in spreadsheets that is
missing from the last two versions??

I don't use spreadsheets but according to Help and what I see in LO
Calc, I see Menu Sheet/ (Top Insert section) Rows (above/below), Columns
(before/after) and Cells (4 choices shift cells down, right, and entire
row or column).
Is that what you mean?

Yes. Version 5.1.6.2 libre office calc (spreadsheet)
There is no Insert Row~Col on top menu drop down. Disappeared on update
prior to 5.1.6.2 whatever it was. Since I use calc frequently, not happy!
How do I erase and re-install please? Basic instruction for novice?

I am currently using LibreOffice 5.1.6.2 and there is an "insert"
column/row. Simply right click on the column/ row and select "insert",
or "delete".
--
cheers,
John B.

I don't use it very much, I am mostly using spreadsheets I created a
long time ago.
BUT, IF an option disappears in a new release, wouldn't it be logic
to ask the developers what happened?
It sure helped me -and others- in one or two occasions.
My view on the zillion linux releases each with their own incompatible
repositories must be very clear here, I am absolutely flabbergasted by
the fact so many people run into problems just because of that but
still do NOT agree with me, instead they add ppa's. :-)
Edmund

Well, I wouldn't argue as I remember an "update" that caused the
printer to stop working and the problem seemed to be that someone had
renamed a printer library or two.

But than again, it is a new version and perhaps one should expect
things to be a bit different. Didn't Linus's first offering use the
command line :-)

--
cheers,

John B.

[Edmund]

Post by John B.

Post by Edmund

Post by John B.

Post by greybeard

Post by Mike Easter

Post by greybeard
Does the latest version restore the "Insert-Row" in spreadsheets that is
missing from the last two versions??

I don't use spreadsheets but according to Help and what I see in LO
Calc, I see Menu Sheet/ (Top Insert section) Rows (above/below), Columns
(before/after) and Cells (4 choices shift cells down, right, and entire
row or column).
Is that what you mean?

Yes. Version 5.1.6.2 libre office calc (spreadsheet)
There is no Insert Row~Col on top menu drop down. Disappeared on update
prior to 5.1.6.2 whatever it was. Since I use calc frequently, not happy!
How do I erase and re-install please? Basic instruction for novice?

I am currently using LibreOffice 5.1.6.2 and there is an "insert"
column/row. Simply right click on the column/ row and select "insert",
or "delete".
--
cheers,
John B.

I don't use it very much, I am mostly using spreadsheets I created a
long time ago.
BUT, IF an option disappears in a new release, wouldn't it be logic
to ask the developers what happened?
It sure helped me -and others- in one or two occasions.
My view on the zillion linux releases each with their own incompatible
repositories must be very clear here, I am absolutely flabbergasted by
the fact so many people run into problems just because of that but
still do NOT agree with me, instead they add ppa's. :-)
Edmund

Well, I wouldn't argue as I remember an "update" that caused the
printer to stop working and the problem seemed to be that someone had
renamed a printer library or two.

Well if things stopped working that is generally a pretty good
indication we are dealing with a bug.

Post by John B.
But than again, it is a new version and perhaps one should expect
things to be a bit different.

That's what I said.

Post by John B.
Didn't Linus's first offering use the command line :-)

exactly

Post by John B.
--
cheers,
John B.

[John B.]

Post by Edmund

Post by John B.

Post by Edmund

Post by John B.

Post by greybeard

Post by Mike Easter

Post by greybeard
Does the latest version restore the "Insert-Row" in spreadsheets that is
missing from the last two versions??

I don't use spreadsheets but according to Help and what I see in LO
Calc, I see Menu Sheet/ (Top Insert section) Rows (above/below), Columns
(before/after) and Cells (4 choices shift cells down, right, and entire
row or column).
Is that what you mean?

Yes. Version 5.1.6.2 libre office calc (spreadsheet)
There is no Insert Row~Col on top menu drop down. Disappeared on update
prior to 5.1.6.2 whatever it was. Since I use calc frequently, not happy!
How do I erase and re-install please? Basic instruction for novice?

I am currently using LibreOffice 5.1.6.2 and there is an "insert"
column/row. Simply right click on the column/ row and select "insert",
or "delete".
--
cheers,
John B.

I don't use it very much, I am mostly using spreadsheets I created a
long time ago.
BUT, IF an option disappears in a new release, wouldn't it be logic
to ask the developers what happened?
It sure helped me -and others- in one or two occasions.
My view on the zillion linux releases each with their own incompatible
repositories must be very clear here, I am absolutely flabbergasted by
the fact so many people run into problems just because of that but
still do NOT agree with me, instead they add ppa's. :-)
Edmund

Well, I wouldn't argue as I remember an "update" that caused the
printer to stop working and the problem seemed to be that someone had
renamed a printer library or two.

Well if things stopped working that is generally a pretty good
indication we are dealing with a bug.

One can only view with some awe the fact that a printer library was,
apparently, arbitrarily, renamed. Or at least the "fix" was to rename
the library to it's original name.

Post by Edmund

Post by John B.
But than again, it is a new version and perhaps one should expect
things to be a bit different.

That's what I said.

Post by John B.
Didn't Linus's first offering use the command line :-)

exactly

Post by John B.
--
cheers,
John B.

--
cheers,

John B.

[greybeard]

Post by John B.

Post by greybeard
Yes. Version 5.1.6.2 libre office calc (spreadsheet)
There is no Insert Row~Col on top menu drop down. Disappeared on update
prior to 5.1.6.2 whatever it was. Since I use calc frequently, not happy!
How do I erase and re-install please? Basic instruction for novice?

I am currently using LibreOffice 5.1.6.2 and there is an "insert"
column/row. Simply right click on the column/ row and select "insert",
or "delete".
--
cheers,
John B.

Yay!! Nice, never knew that was available. Problem solved for me.
Thanks to those with remove/reinstall instructions but I don't to
now.

PS I did look in synaptic and calc is listed as installed as stand alone
to the other libre office packages, but when checked un-install all
manner of other stuff would disappear I shied away from that......
cheers

[Aragorn]

Post by greybeard
Basic instruction for novice?

Not a reply to your question and off-topic — my apologies — but would
you happen to be the same "greybeard" as registered over at P.A.? ;)

[greybeard]

Post by Aragorn

Post by greybeard
Basic instruction for novice?

Not a reply to your question and off-topic — my apologies — but would
you happen to be the same "greybeard" as registered over at P.A.? ;)

No. Not me. I don't even understand "registered over at PA."
Genuine novice :-)

cheers

[Aragorn]

Post by greybeard

Post by Aragorn

Post by greybeard
Basic instruction for novice?

Not a reply to your question and off-topic — my apologies — but
would you happen to be the same "greybeard" as registered over at
P.A.? ;)

No. Not me. I don't even understand "registered over at PA."
Genuine novice :-)

P.A. is a non-computer-related forum — although they do have a thread
about GNU/Linux — and there is a member there by the same screen name
as yours. He's also a novice in the area of GNU/Linux, and I know that
he uses Mint. ;)

Anyway, sorry for the confusion, then. :)